Comments on: The hard truth about the Irish knowledge economy: http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/ News, views and a little bit more. Fri, 05 Mar 2010 10:50:41 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: AW http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-434489 AW Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:11:21 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-434489 Irish Schools lucky enough to have modern computers use them an hour a week just to fill a stat sheet about IT on their website. I am not surprised about the "Dumbing Down" phrase and I agree with the previous posters view on the "knowledge economy" myth. If you put 100 kids or adults for that matter in a room.....who would be the smartest at a given time? The one with Broadband and google in front of them. Yet we are in the Third World of Broadband and High Tech Jobs are moving elsewhere. Irish Schools lucky enough to have modern computers use them an hour a week just to fill a stat sheet about IT on their website.

I am not surprised about the “Dumbing Down” phrase and I agree with the previous posters view on the “knowledge economy” myth.

If you put 100 kids or adults for that matter in a room…..who would be the smartest at a given time?
The one with Broadband and google in front of them.

Yet we are in the Third World of Broadband and High Tech Jobs are moving elsewhere.

]]> By: PB http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-429543 PB Wed, 27 May 2009 07:57:59 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-429543 I concur. Also the jobs are Google are pretty low end operations jobs, god forbid you'd be working on an end user product. Lots of ahem, 'Internal Development' jobs, Yawn. I concur. Also the jobs are Google are pretty low end operations jobs, god forbid you’d be working on an end user product. Lots of ahem, ‘Internal Development’ jobs, Yawn.

]]> By: antigravity http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-376015 antigravity Wed, 14 Jan 2009 02:34:33 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-376015 They could hire some of the guys from Steorn? They could hire some of the guys from Steorn?

]]> By: Teknovis » The Calibre of Irish Software Engineers http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-375840 Teknovis » The Calibre of Irish Software Engineers Tue, 13 Jan 2009 20:58:05 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-375840 [...] I read a really interesting blog post recently titled The hard truth about the Irish knowledge economy that is commenting on the fact that Google has decided to abandon its plans to create an additional 100 jobs in Dublin for software engineers. The apparent reason for this change is plan is that it has been unable to recruit staff of the right calibre. [...] [...] I read a really interesting blog post recently titled The hard truth about the Irish knowledge economy that is commenting on the fact that Google has decided to abandon its plans to create an additional 100 jobs in Dublin for software engineers. The apparent reason for this change is plan is that it has been unable to recruit staff of the right calibre. [...]

]]> By: Fluffy Links - Wednesday January 7th 2009 « Damien Mulley http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-373538 Fluffy Links - Wednesday January 7th 2009 « Damien Mulley Wed, 07 Jan 2009 12:32:09 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-373538 [...] If you're new here, you may want to subscribe to my site using a feedreader or email. Thanks for visiting - Damien.Google says that Irish tech/dev people aren’t good enough for them. As is pointed out, a HR process where 13 interviews over 6-9 months is almost the standard is inefficient and just plain stupid. Who in this economic climate can wait that long? [...] [...] If you’re new here, you may want to subscribe to my site using a feedreader or email. Thanks for visiting – Damien.Google says that Irish tech/dev people aren’t good enough for them. As is pointed out, a HR process where 13 interviews over 6-9 months is almost the standard is inefficient and just plain stupid. Who in this economic climate can wait that long? [...]

]]> By: MP http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-373528 MP Wed, 07 Jan 2009 11:56:29 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-373528 Hi. The Herald line was actually a pick up from a story the previous day in the irish edition of the sunday times, which isn't actually availabale online (ironic, that) Here's the full text.... Business Ireland misses out on new Google jobs Mark Paul 393 words 21 December 2008 The Sunday Times 1 1 English (c) 2008 Times Newspapers Limited. All rights reserved GOOGLE has abandoned plans to locate up to 100 software engineering jobs in Ireland because it was unable to find enough qualified candidates here. John Herlihy, Google's vicepresident for online sales and the head of its Dublin-based European headquarters, said the highly skilled jobs went to other Google offices in Europe. He blamed the loss of the jobs on a "dumbing down" of educational standards. "We wanted to recruit up to 100 software engineers, but we couldn't find candidates of the calibre we were looking for in Ireland," he said. "The jobs have been lost. We have since built different engineering teams in countries including Poland, Norway and Switzerland. We have a great team of 30 engineers here, but it could have been 100." In September 2007, Nelson Mattos, Google's head of engineering for Europe, announced it was planning to beef up its engineering presence in Europe as it moved to tailor its offerings towards local markets. In October, Google released its third quarter results showing that it hired about 250 engineers in the three months to the end of September. Ireland was expected to be one of the main beneficiaries of the recruitment drive. Google's Dublin operation already employs about 1,500 people. The government, which last week launched its strategy for building a "smart economy", has said it is targeting high-tech jobs to drive future economic growth. "We hear a lot about this knowledge economy of ours. But I've been back in Ireland for four years and I still don't know what it is," said Herlihy. "I'm not sure the quality and the output of our third level [colleges] is as good as we think it is," he said. "There's a huge amount of dumbing down at third level and second level." Herlihy pointed to what he described as the "streams" of people who leave college with firstclass honours degrees or who achieve seven A1s in the Leaving Certificate. "Those results used to be hard to get," he said. "We're throwing massive amounts of money at third level institutes. Too much. You can't continue to throw public money after seven universities. You have to decide whether we only need two or three, and which of those will be top." Hi. The Herald line was actually a pick up from a story the previous day in the irish edition of the sunday times, which isn’t actually availabale online (ironic, that)

Here’s the full text….

Business
Ireland misses out on new Google jobs
Mark Paul
393 words
21 December 2008
The Sunday Times
1
1
English
(c) 2008 Times Newspapers Limited. All rights reserved

GOOGLE has abandoned plans to locate up to 100 software engineering jobs in Ireland because it was unable to find enough qualified candidates here.

John Herlihy, Google’s vicepresident for online sales and the head of its Dublin-based European headquarters, said the highly skilled jobs went to other Google offices in Europe. He blamed the loss of the jobs on a “dumbing down” of educational standards.

“We wanted to recruit up to 100 software engineers, but we couldn’t find candidates of the calibre we were looking for in Ireland,” he said.

“The jobs have been lost. We have since built different engineering teams in countries including Poland, Norway and Switzerland. We have a great team of 30 engineers here, but it could have been 100.”

In September 2007, Nelson Mattos, Google’s head of engineering for Europe, announced it was planning to beef up its engineering presence in Europe as it moved to tailor its offerings towards local markets.

In October, Google released its third quarter results showing that it hired about 250 engineers in the three months to the end of September.

Ireland was expected to be one of the main beneficiaries of the recruitment drive. Google’s Dublin operation already employs about 1,500 people.

The government, which last week launched its strategy for building a “smart economy”, has said it is targeting high-tech jobs to drive future economic growth.

“We hear a lot about this knowledge economy of ours. But I’ve been back in Ireland for four years and I still don’t know what it is,” said Herlihy.

“I’m not sure the quality and the output of our third level [colleges] is as good as we think it is,” he said. “There’s a huge amount of dumbing down at third level and second level.”

Herlihy pointed to what he described as the “streams” of people who leave college with firstclass honours degrees or who achieve seven A1s in the Leaving Certificate. “Those results used to be hard to get,” he said.

“We’re throwing massive amounts of money at third level institutes. Too much. You can’t continue to throw public money after seven universities. You have to decide whether we only need two or three, and which of those will be top.”

]]> By: mj http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-372735 mj Mon, 05 Jan 2009 11:05:24 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-372735 My gut feeling is that this is a way of just pulling jobs due to the fact that advertising revenue is bottoming out and Google doesn't need another 100 low end operations workers to add to their army in Dublin. Frankly I'm not surprised. I am surprised however that they would blame it on the lack of suitably qualified candidates. Rings of a company quickly disappearing up it's own arse. My gut feeling is that this is a way of just pulling jobs due to the fact that advertising revenue is bottoming out and Google doesn’t need another 100 low end operations workers to add to their army in Dublin.

Frankly I’m not surprised.

I am surprised however that they would blame it on the lack of suitably qualified candidates. Rings of a company quickly disappearing up it’s own arse.

]]> By: Irish Election » Determining the way early on http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-372723 Irish Election » Determining the way early on Mon, 05 Jan 2009 10:27:51 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-372723 [...] The National Debt balooned by E13 billion last year alone, our balance of trade is all over the shop and Google are pulling out of basing in Ireland because of low quality graduates. So here we are, and here we go - if they continue to stay behind the curve and below expectations, they are out on their ear. We have 3 or more elections before 2012 and the place goes to pot. Asking for five years is all well and good but to ask with no purpose or vision is not going to swing. [...] [...] The National Debt balooned by E13 billion last year alone, our balance of trade is all over the shop and Google are pulling out of basing in Ireland because of low quality graduates. So here we are, and here we go – if they continue to stay behind the curve and below expectations, they are out on their ear. We have 3 or more elections before 2012 and the place goes to pot. Asking for five years is all well and good but to ask with no purpose or vision is not going to swing. [...]

]]> By: John Looney http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-372545 John Looney Mon, 05 Jan 2009 00:12:52 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-372545 Alas, the Herald are probably right. Most Irish computing graduates are crap, due to our apathetic university system. When graduates enter the workplace, they are hired by companies who assume they are crap before they walk in the door, and are willing to tolerate mediocrity, as long as it's cheap. I've personally interviewed about 200 engineers in the last few years. Mostly people with shit-hot CVs, who managed to get by the Google recruiter's with flying colours. From memory, 90% of candidates were non-Irish, though Google seemed to have hired a higher proportion of Irish engineers; perhaps easier relocation is a factor. I think the Evening Herald have it spot-on; Google wanted to hire ~100 more soft-eng folk in Dublin this year. They couldn't, even though the majority of the applicants were non-Irish! Irish Engineers are pretty crap, and Ireland is just not an attractive location for high-end computing folk (wages vs. cost-of-living is rubbish). We source heavily from Eastern Europe, so visas are not usually a problem. It doesn't help that most good Irish engineers get jobs through their friends, so have no interviewing experience - Google was the first real interview I'd had since I'd left college...so even really good people freak out and get declined. And as Justin said, interviewing at Google is not for the faint-hearted, and likely shrinks the available engineer pool further. If the government is serious about a 'knowledge economy', we need real tech universities. Ones that fail people if they can't pass the course (rather than make the course easier) and ones that can afford to hire superstar lecturers/support staff who really know their stuff. John Alas, the Herald are probably right. Most Irish computing graduates are crap, due to our apathetic university system. When graduates enter the workplace, they are hired by companies who assume they are crap before they walk in the door, and are willing to tolerate mediocrity, as long as it’s cheap.

I’ve personally interviewed about 200 engineers in the last few years. Mostly people with shit-hot CVs, who managed to get by the Google recruiter’s with flying colours. From memory, 90% of candidates were non-Irish, though Google seemed to have hired a higher proportion of Irish engineers; perhaps easier relocation is a factor.

I think the Evening Herald have it spot-on; Google wanted to hire ~100 more soft-eng folk in Dublin this year. They couldn’t, even though the majority of the applicants were non-Irish! Irish Engineers are pretty crap, and Ireland is just not an attractive location for high-end computing folk (wages vs. cost-of-living is rubbish). We source heavily from Eastern Europe, so visas are not usually a problem.

It doesn’t help that most good Irish engineers get jobs through their friends, so have no interviewing experience – Google was the first real interview I’d had since I’d left college…so even really good people freak out and get declined. And as Justin said, interviewing at Google is not for the faint-hearted, and likely shrinks the available engineer pool further.

If the government is serious about a ‘knowledge economy’, we need real tech universities. Ones that fail people if they can’t pass the course (rather than make the course easier) and ones that can afford to hire superstar lecturers/support staff who really know their stuff.

John

]]> By: Joe Drumgoole http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/comment-page-1/#comment-372499 Joe Drumgoole Sun, 04 Jan 2009 22:52:34 +0000 http://www.eire.com/2009/01/04/the-hard-truth-about-the-irish-knowledge-economy/#comment-372499 I concur. Also the jobs are Google are pretty low end operations jobs, god forbid you'd be working on an end user product. Lots of ahem, 'Internal Development' jobs, Yawn. I concur. Also the jobs are Google are pretty low end operations jobs, god forbid you’d be working on an end user product. Lots of ahem, ‘Internal Development’ jobs, Yawn.

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